Poker-AI.org

Poker AI and Botting Discussion Forum
It is currently Mon Nov 13, 2023 5:23 pm

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 5:28 pm 
Offline
Veteran Member

Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:39 am
Posts: 437
So, it looks like HUL has been solved (by neopokerbot)?
http://www.computerpokercompetition.org ... l=&start=1

And, congrats to Marv for regaining his bankroll throne.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 6:13 pm 
Offline
Junior Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:06 pm
Posts: 20
Quote:
We complete Fixed Limit Hold’em game tree search without approximation


:o


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 6:32 pm 
Offline
Veteran Member

Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:39 am
Posts: 437
Neo Poker Bot beat Hyperborean (IRO) by 11.2 +/- 6.2 millibets in this year's run off competition. Last year's Hyperborean (or which ever strategy the U of A discussed in their papers), was exploitable by 62 millibets.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 7:00 pm 
Offline
New Member

Joined: Sat Mar 09, 2013 4:56 pm
Posts: 5
I'll set up the server again if you want to play again Marv.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 7:26 pm 
Offline
Junior Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:06 pm
Posts: 20
the slumbot NL 's paper :

http://www.aaai.org/ocs/index.php/WS/AA ... /view/7044


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:20 pm 
Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 9:57 pm
Posts: 15
Nasher wrote:
Neo Poker Bot beat Hyperborean (IRO) by 11.2 +/- 6.2 millibets in this year's run off competition. Last year's Hyperborean (or which ever strategy the U of A discussed in their papers), was exploitable by 62 millibets.

So what? It means that Best Response vs Hyperborean's strategy will exploit it 62mb/h. But accurate nash equlibrium strategy can potentially beat it by 11.2mb/h.
Maybe someone remember how much space in terabytes full FLHU strategy takes? If we assume keeping data in doubles, and without compressing?


Last edited by Hipp on Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:28 pm 
Offline
Veteran Member

Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:39 am
Posts: 437
I'm guessing there's some degree of exploitability in NPB's play, if only due to compressing/truncating the game for the competition. By that +11 millibets, I'm guestimating how close it is to a real EQ.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Wed Jul 17, 2013 11:08 pm 
Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2013 10:52 pm
Posts: 21
Hello all. I was interested in seeing some of the NL hands between Slumbot and Hyperborean.iro so I converted about ~100k of their hands into PokerStars hand history format so Holdem Manager 2 can import them. It's setup so the holecards are visible while watching in the hand replayer. If anyone else is curious, I just put it on the first file sharing site that Google returned: http://www.filedropper.com/hyperboreanirovsslumbotnl

I couldn't help but notice that Ben Sulsky submitted a bot to the NL competition too. He's better known online as Sauce123 and is one of the best big bet cash game players... Cool to see him experimenting.

Edit: the previous file hosting site I used had a pretty short expiration time... Here's a new link: http://www.fileswap.com/dl/Q7X0GOP31V/

Edit: new new link: http://www.fileswap.com/dl/7n7nKXVfYd/


Last edited by nonpareil on Sat Mar 08, 2014 9:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:03 pm 
Offline
Junior Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:06 pm
Posts: 20
nonpareil wrote:
Hello all. I was interested in seeing some of the NL hands between Slumbot and Hyperborean.iro so I converted about ~100k of their hands into PokerStars hand history format so Holdem Manager 2 can import them. It's setup so the holecards are visible while watching in the hand replayer. If anyone else is curious, I just put it on the first file sharing site that Google returned: http://www.filedropper.com/hyperboreanirovsslumbotnl


TY !!!!

nonpareil wrote:
I couldn't help but notice that Ben Sulsky submitted a bot to the NL competition too. He's better known online as Sauce123 and is one of the best big bet cash game players... Cool to see him experimenting.


Sauce123 :shock:
I think that it's the only botter of the competition who is better than his bot :lol:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:14 pm 
Offline
Junior Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:06 pm
Posts: 20
Image

it's so close


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:34 pm 
Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Mon Apr 22, 2013 11:46 am
Posts: 34
^
what's up with the showdown/non-showdown lines? is slumbot in the same position every hand or how can they be so asymmetrical?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:47 pm 
Offline
Junior Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:06 pm
Posts: 20
somehomelessguy wrote:
^
what's up with the showdown/non-showdown lines? is slumbot in the same position every hand or how can they be so asymmetrical?


no there is no filter.
they play a différent style
superborean seems more aggressive, he 3b 15%, 2.52 postflop AF whereas slumbot 3b 10% & 1.86 postflop AF


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:54 pm 
Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:45 pm
Posts: 24
Isildur11 wrote:
somehomelessguy wrote:
^
what's up with the showdown/non-showdown lines? is slumbot in the same position every hand or how can they be so asymmetrical?


no there is no filter.
they play a différent style
superborean seems more aggressive, he 3b 15%, 2.52 postflop AF whereas slumbot 3b 10% & 1.86 postflop AF


Confirmed. I imported a few more hands than you.

Image

Also it seems like slumbot limps a lot more preflop.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:15 pm 
Offline
Veteran Member

Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:40 pm
Posts: 269
I played the neopoker bot for a few hundred hands and it plays terrible for HU NL. The first thing I noticed is that it folds to a 3 bet about 95% of the time. It also does not have a 3 bet flatting range so its either fold or all in. So OOP to beat it you just 3 bet every hand and fold to the all-in. It raises about 90% of buttons so the 3 bet is highly effective against it. I raised 90% of buttons as well and Its flatting range is typical..broadways..suited aces etc so its highly predictable. It 3 bets top 10% or so and wider if its short of course. A 4 bet will just result in an allin just like OOP. I saw no adjustment whatsoever.

Post flop it plays way too tight and its easy to range it. It does not handle a check raise or a double/triple barrel that well. When it does 3 bet or raise its 2 pair or better unless its short. I have yet to see a bluff raise. It also does not seem to notice differences in bet sizing and what that could mean. Like it was very weak against a triple deke type of play.

Most bots do not handle aggression correctly and this one is no exception as its easy to run over. The flaws with this bot showed up after just a few hands of play.

Update: I played a few hundred more it did start calling a few of my 3 bets but certainly not enough to overcome my 100% 3 bet advantage. I also saw it bluff raise/stack off with bottom pair which was rather bold based on the board texture


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 7:44 am 
Offline
Veteran Member

Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:39 am
Posts: 437
Quote:
We complete Fixed Limit Hold’em game tree search without approximation

I was thinking about this as I work on board texture. I think they used statistics to classify "same" hands according to metrics that allowed for real-game precision.

I can reduce the flop board from about 22k combinations to about 2.2k by using the stats method I've mentioned elsewhere on this forum. Of course, my method probably isn't precise to the real game, the point is even without clustering, just removing duplicates, it's a 90% reduction.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:48 pm 
Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2013 7:52 am
Posts: 11
nonpareil wrote:
Hello all. I was interested in seeing some of the NL hands between Slumbot and Hyperborean.iro so I converted about ~100k of their hands into PokerStars hand history format so Holdem Manager 2 can import them. It's setup so the holecards are visible while watching in the hand replayer. If anyone else is curious, I just put it on the first file sharing site that Google returned: http://www.filedropper.com/hyperboreanirovsslumbotnl

I couldn't help but notice that Ben Sulsky submitted a bot to the NL competition too. He's better known online as Sauce123 and is one of the best big bet cash game players... Cool to see him experimenting.

Edit: the previous file hosting site I used had a pretty short expiration time... Here's a new link: http://www.fileswap.com/dl/Q7X0GOP31V/


Ty, Sir. What did you use for HH conversion to PS format?

Regarding Sauce, it is his dad that is the programmer behind the project.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 12:01 pm 
Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:45 pm
Posts: 24
I noticed that hyperborean_iro never flats premium hands from the BB (QQ+, AK) facing an opening raise (it always 3-bets) which sounds logical. I am wondering if approximate NE for shorter stacks (say 25bb) still never flats those hands. Anyone that has solved these short stack games find the same strategy?

Thanks.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:06 am 
Offline
New Member

Joined: Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:01 am
Posts: 1
Great discussion, unfortunately it died down.

I tried to use nonpareil download links but none of those 2 seems to be working anymore.
Could anyone be so kind and reupload or pn me with instructions?

Thanks guys and keep up to good work!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ACPC 2013
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 7:00 am 
Offline
Regular Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 25, 2013 7:36 am
Posts: 73
nonpareil wrote:
[...] I converted about ~100k of their hands into PokerStars hand history format so Holdem Manager 2 can import them [...]


Would you mind sharing your code for creating importable PokerStars-HH?


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ] 

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group