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 Post subject: Play against Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:01 pm 
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Hello,

We are Neo Poker Lab, group of scientists working on AI development for a long time.
We invite all forum readers to play against our AI which took part in 2012 ACPC on our website (which is currently in beta). Please send all feedbacks to our email, via PM or post it here. We have NLHU and FLHU Hold’em available for play at the moment and are planning to add new games soon.

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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:20 pm 
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I played the HUNLHE and FWIW it plays good tight poker on a small sample though.
Does it use timing tells?
Just a GUI suggestion, could you make the mouse wheel moving the size of the bet up and down?


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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:20 pm 
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Good job, but this is not NLHE , we can't bet the exact amount that we want.

i love overbeting 120% river, i can't
i love 4b 2.2X 100deep , i can't


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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 8:32 pm 
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Are you sure you clicked the NL option?


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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 8:49 pm 
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the scroll bar is white and the background is white too , so i've missed it, my bad :xx08
sorry


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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:22 pm 
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i think that i have an edge.
he has some leaks, for example his pot control range seems capped, when he checks behind flop, you can overbet 100% turn.
but maybe i got lucky ...


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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:03 pm 
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The hand evaluation seems buggy. See Hand ID 7333 - all-in split situation. There were other occasions too. I didn't pay attention.


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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 3:22 pm 
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Thanks for feedback everybody!

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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 6:42 pm 
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Played a bit too.

As far as I understand it plays very similar to my AI and I also think I have an edge.

I dont know if it adapts, but if it does, it does slowly. So, being aggressive on dangerous boards, betting if there was check on previuos streets and so on makes straight winning pattern.

Which games are you aiming at?

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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 11:47 am 
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LOLWorld wrote:
I played the HUNLHE and FWIW it plays good tight poker on a small sample though.
Does it use timing tells?

No it doesn't. We believe that timing tells are important domain for research but we haven't worked on it yet.

LOLWorld wrote:
Just a GUI suggestion, could you make the mouse wheel moving the size of the bet up and down?

As for moving bet size with mouse wheel - it's on our to do list, should be implemented soon.

Kratt wrote:
The hand evaluation seems buggy. See Hand ID 7333 - all-in split situation. There were other occasions too. I didn't pay attention.

Yes, indeed, thank you. It has been fixed.

kenu7 wrote:
i think that i have an edge.
he has some leaks, for example his pot control range seems capped, when he checks behind flop, you can overbet 100% turn.
but maybe i got lucky ...

concretemixer wrote:
Played a bit too.

As far as I understand it plays very similar to my AI and I also think I have an edge.

I dont know if it adapts, but if it does, it does slowly. So, being aggressive on dangerous boards, betting if there was check on previuos streets and so on makes straight winning pattern.

Thank you for strategy related questions. They will be addressed later.

concretemixer wrote:
Which games are you aiming at?

One thing for sure - it'll be some popular card game :)

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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 3:43 pm 
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Looks good so far. I've only tried the HU NL for about 20 minutes. Are there any plans to release an API so you can see how it performs against other bots?

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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 1:16 pm 
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birchy wrote:
Looks good so far. I've only tried the HU NL for about 20 minutes. Are there any plans to release an API so you can see how it performs against other bots?

Well we might release it at some point but currently there is no definite time frames for this.

LOLWorld wrote:
Just a GUI suggestion, could you make the mouse wheel moving the size of the bet up and down?

Done. We also made some improvements so now everything should work more stable.

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 Post subject: Re: Test Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 1:45 pm 
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Hello,

We added new games so visit our website to check it out.

P.S.: to moderators - if possible please change thread title to "Play against Neo Poker AI"?

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 Post subject: Re: Play against Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:05 pm 
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I'm not a strong player, but this seems good to me.


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 Post subject: Re: Play against Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:18 am 
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played it HU and it pushed A7o against 4bet. does not seem very profitable.


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 Post subject: Re: Play against Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:40 am 
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Still the way too weak.

Now it is very aggressive by no reason - you can call it down three streets with third pair and win at showdown. And it still does not adapt.

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 Post subject: Re: Play against Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:24 pm 
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Double check raise on the Axxx super dry board with A7 in a simple raised pot. Not very good idea against unknown opponent.

Any information on implementation? Like how you chose where to use neural networks or tree search or equilibrium approximations?


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 Post subject: Re: Play against Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:26 pm 
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how many hands does it need before it starts adjusting? I played very loose agressive and NEO came up with ridic responses like 4b/c A7s for 150bb which was probably good at that tiem (just seems like he might be overadjusting too fast and be exploitable in that way?


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 Post subject: Re: Play against Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 2:56 pm 
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First time visitors of our website are generally very loose passive or extremely loose aggressive players (95% of time). So actually our AI has adapted in some way before you even start play. And of course if you're playing differently from main line you could exploit it for a few hands with reasonably tight style.

So If AI finds you differ from other players it starts to shift its strategy given how different your strategy is and in which spots. If your strategy despite being different is still unreasonable AI could quickly adapt reacting to your play. However it could adapt more slowly if you are constantly switching strategies with help of your average profile, which is progressively changed so that the hands you played the last change AI strategy a lot more than hands that you played say 3 days ago. So we found that such approach is better than trying predictably or randomly leveling you and try to predict your adaption to recent games.

I also find that some people do not understand how better response against their strategy looks like. For example - if they play very loose they expect bot to play tight which is *probably* good (if aggressor is really dumb) for taking some chips without much risk, but is not even close to maximizing EV.

One more thing with regard to how Neo identifies you. If you play with Guest account AI identifies you using cookie of the browser and adapts to your play as long as the cookie exists. If for example you clear cookie or don’t save them or play from different places AI could consider you as a new player. We recommend our users to play with a registered account to observe AI adaptation in longer period.

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 Post subject: Re: Play against Neo Poker AI
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 4:25 pm 
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What's the cookie timeout?


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